1. Before studying art in France, you earned a B.A. in Chinese literature, and subsequently an M.F.A in ink brush painting. How do your in-depth studies in Chinese culture benefit your studies in art later on?
Before answering this question, I think it’s necessary to fill you in on my background. I began learning painting at the age of three thanks to the influence of my family. Since I was a child, I often heard the saying that a solid cultural foundation is highly important if one aims to be a good painter. Those of an older generation often expressed regret over having focused too much on learning the techniques of painting while ignoring other subjects at school. They told me that I’d be able to develop further as an artist if I enroll in a normal high school instead of an affiliated high school to art academy (one focuses solely on art education). The opinion has certainly affected the choices I’ve made in my academic career.
I thought that if learning other subjects can be beneficial to my painting, I should go far in my studies. When I graduated from Chinese literature and transitioned into art, I quickly realized that literature and art are two completely different disciplines, they are not even mutually complementary. However, my studies in logic have served as a constant reminder that the training in painting, at least on a cognitive level, has its shortcomings.
I encountered new challenges when I went to study in France. My earlier studies in Chinese literature helped me realize that I needed to disenchant this new culture instead of mystifying it. And this has supported my studies in the following years.
Looking back at my studies in Chinese, I have forgotten a lot of the things that my professors taught me, but I’ve benefitted massively from the training in my cognitive abilities.
2.What were the subjects that you chose to paint before the “#loveme” series?
I need to first distinguish “painting” from “painting in contemporary art”. “Painting” emphasizes the “how” of painting, whereas “painting in contemporary art” focuses on the “what”. Therefore, the choice of subject matter is not top priority in painting. This doesn’t mean the subject is unimportant. The subject matter is part of the painter’s final expression. But in the painting process, the painter must first figure out how to paint. This distinction is important for the viewer as well. When you look at a portrait painting, for instance, you don’t need to immediately recognize the subject, whether it is a portrait of a king or an average citizen, whether it is a stranger or a familiar face. You should focus on how the painting is made and whether it is a good one. On the other hand, a “painting in contemporary art” leads the viewer to another direction by asking who the subject is, or if it has any relation with the viewer. And a painting can be only considered legitimate if the identity of the subject matter can be properly explained. While this type of thinking is laughable when we look at “painting” in its purest sense, it is quite politically correct in contemporary art.
Most of my paintings before “#loveme” fall into the realm of contemporary art. The “Corps-paysage” series, for instance, was about the different faces at a banquet, and I used food ingredients such as red wine and soy sauce as paint. Another series is called “Corps-paysage”, a series of portraits for deceased people. I applied “texture strokes pattern”, a technique in Chinese ink brush painting, to render a monumental quality to the paintings, à la Anselm Kiefer. Compared to my pro-painting-independence stance, I have to say those paintings were rather capitulationist.
On the other hand, two of my earlier series were special. One is “Mème”, a series of paintings based on internet emojis. The last step of completing the painting was to convert them back into emoji files that can be used on social media. The painting process was very much a complete part on its own. The other series is called “Enfant, poisson et lotus (Qu'il y ait des excédents tous les ans)”. It consists of paintings that are recreations of images in real life, which furthers the experiment that I started in “Mème”. For me, those two series can be considered historical paintings.
3. Why did you say that this series is your last attempt to show goodwill to contemporary art critics? What makes you believe that “painting” needs to stand on its own and not be part of contemporary art?
Because my paintings become independent (from contemporary art) after this series! (Laughs)
Talking about decoupling painting from contemporary art, we have to first talk about the qualities of contemporary art that differentiate it from painting. These qualities are intrinsic, which means it can never coexist with painting again. The differences might be subtle to outsiders, but they're quite prominent to us professionals.
Let's take a somewhat inappropriate example: most people can't tell Gilles Deleuze from Jean Baudrillard based on appearances. When they were old, both were white men with similar facial features and expressions, both were bold and had wrinkles. When you search their names on Google, you’d often see people misuse one’s photo for another. However, these two are drastically different for those who study philosophy. Though, seasoned scholars would tell you that Baudrillard always wore glasses and Deleuze rarely did, and that you’d have to put Michel Foucault’s glasses on Deleuze’ face to make him look like Baudrillard.
4. You said earlier that selfies have their own qualities, and that they are “petite bourgeoisie”. Could you expand on that observation?
The selfies that people take every day consist of many symbols and visual elements that convey information, implicitly or explicitly, to those who can recognize, or look up to, the lifestyle on display. When a person showcases his/her French meal, for instance, the selfie likely contains a loosely arranged salad with avocado, smoked salmon, cherry tomatoes(ones that display beautiful colors). And the food must be all organic, accompanied by wine, of which the place of origin is accidentally revealed on the sticker, as well as one’s beautifully decorated hand or feet. The viewers, through these visual hints, understand that the person who took the selfie tries to tell everyone that he/she was there. Selfies like this adhere to the many criteria of mainstream aesthetics.
Roland Barthes once expressed appreciation to the medium of photography because it is objective and allows little manipulation. However, things have changed, and selfies are no longer the kind of photography in Barthes’ era. They are more like neo-mythology. Barthes would’ve had plenty to say about the selfies people take nowadays. Though little of what he would’ve said can be new since he’s already written plenty about it in his book “Mythologies”.
The many tricks and thoughts I have about creativity are hidden in the titles of “#loveme” and in the preparation process for the exhibition. I couldn’t take part in the preparation this time, so I won’t expand on it. The titles of the paintings are still the same. Some are from the lyrics of Serge Gainsbourg or Elvis Presley. Those who are well-versed in those songs would get the hint.
5. Why do you feel free after completing this series?
The word “free” has two meanings.
One is about the independence and liberation of painting, which allows me to no longer adhere to the criteria of the contemporary art circle.
The other is the feeling of completion. Completing this series brought me a sense of ease.
6.What are your plans for the future?
Although I have made, and am continuing to make, many series of paintings, they are all part of one creative act, which is painting. I simply look for excuses to paint. There’s no secret to my creativity.
Like many painters, I hope my works can be richer, purer, bigger and somehow “less”. These are the goals I’ve set for myself and I need to achieve them one by one.